Featured The P in T.U.L.I.P

What a twisted grasp of perseverance.
What do you fail to understand when God determines your position in Christ, gives you faith to believe and ensures your faith will persevere through the storms of life? How do you end up calling such a view "no better than works salvation?"
It's clear you have adopted an extreme prejudice against anyone who believes in God's Sovereignty over all things. You now apply your bitterness to the fact that God, himself, enables you to persevere. I can only conclude that you don't want or need God and thus desire to save yourself by your own willpower. Otherwise you would fully embrace the perseverance of the saints.

 

Please state your case, why do you claim the P does not provide eternal security?

 

Of course it is Lord ship salvation. Just like Catholics they believe they can work there way to heaven. If they do no works then they aren't Christian. Sounds like works for Salvation to me.
MB

 

You are not hearing. The saved are eternally saved and as such do endure because God causes them to endure and is tbe one who solely does the saving and the keeping.

The saved know God through Christ. Those who are not yet saved do not as yet know God.

 

So we were not chosen for salvation through faith in the truth? I agree the "P" carries baggage not supported in scripture, but generally it refers to eternal security, once saved, always saved.

 

I was all set to click the "agree" button but I was a little worried the unsaved "do not know God" might carry the meaning they cannot seek God and put their trust fully in Christ, which of course they have sufficient knowledge of God to do.

 

Sir, 2 Thessalonians says chosen for salvation, not service.

 

6 For I, Jehovah, change not; therefore ye, O sons of Jacob, are not consumed. Mal 3

8 Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and to-day, yea and for ever. Heb 13

 

Note: John 17;3. 1 John 4:7. 2 Thessalonians 1:8.

 

I do not understand the problem. Is Jesus not Lord? Is Jesus not Savior? Is Jesus going to fail on his promise when he says he will not leave us nor forsake us?

The elect are Israel. (Romans 9:6-8)
But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel, and not all are children of Abraham because they are his offspring, but “Through Isaac shall your offspring be named.” This means that it is not the
children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.

What do you mean by this? Are you asking if I believe every child of God is a part of the Kingdom? If so, yes. Every child of God, whom God has chosen, is a part of the Kingdom.

I preach what Paul preached in 2 Corinthians 5:11-21.

Therefore, knowing the fear of the Lord, we persuade others. But what we are is known to God, and I hope it is known also to your conscience. We are not commending ourselves to you again but giving you cause to boast about us, so that you may be able to answer those who boast about outward appearance and not about what is in the heart. For if we are beside ourselves, it is for God; if we are in our right mind, it is for you. For the love of Christ controls us, because we have concluded this: that one has died for all, therefore all have died; and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised. From now on, therefore, we regard no one according to the flesh. Even though we once regarded Christ according to the flesh, we regard him thus no longer.

Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come. All this is from God, who through Christ reconciled us to himself and gave us the ministry of reconciliation; that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.

Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God. For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

Barry, it seems that you have bought into a hyperdispensationalism that has derailed you from understanding the work of grace throughout all of the Bible, from Adam to the return of Christ Jesus as King, who will rule over his Kingdom for eternity. It may be this hyperdispensationalism which acts as an obstacle to you seeing the whole of scripture. Consider seeing the scripture in light of the covenants God has established with his chosen people. It may help clear up the obvious discomfort you are experiencing.