Featured Should a Christian police officer lie?

That question has already been answered. Refer to my first response to your first question to me.

 

How about spies and covert military operations? Deception and misdirection are part and parcel of their success. Are their lies equal to someone who lies from a sinful motive? If your answer to that question is "yes", then an appeal must be made to grace and mercy.

 

Again I already answered that question in a previous post.

I mean you no disrespect but you keep asking the same question even when it has been answered. Refer to post 16.

 

I think the problem here is that you do not believe the passage in Rev. and are trying to find a way around it in a sinning manner. So let me ask you a question. If a spy's job is to literally sleep, live in fornication, with the enemy is that acceptable to God? Does the job justify the sinning? Why would it be any different with lying? If as believers are in a situation that would cause us to sin we need to get out of that situation, NOT try and justify it. Is it acceptable for a Christian woman to become a prostitute to feed her children? Or how about a Christian man to rob to feed his family? Go back to scripture and believe what is written.

Rev 21:8
But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

1Co 6:9
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Co 6:10
Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

1Jo 3:8
Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil.
1Jo 3:9
No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God’s[fn] seed abides in him; and he cannot keep on sinning, because he has been born of God.

So we can conclude if a person is doing these things, regardless the reasons or profession, they ARE NOT a Christian and yes they will end up in the lake of fire if they die in their lost condition. Real Christians go to prison or even death to keep themselves from the practice of sin. I think we have lost site of what a Christian is.

 

That was BEFORE the commandments and before they knew lying was sin. Also God looked on them favorably not for their lie, but for them saving the babies.

 

Hebrews 11:31, ". . . By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace. . . ." Joshua 2:4, ". . . the woman took the two men, and hid them, and said thus, There came men unto me, but I wist not whence they were: . . ."

 

No.

peace to you

 

Your verbose reply misses the point of grace and mercy. We all sin. We all sin daily. We often find ourselves in positions where we are tempted to rationalize our decisions. When we yield to the Spirit we act righteously. When we do not, we sin. When we sin there is grace and mercy, but there are often temporal consequences for our sin. You pontificate as someone who is in a hurry to cast the first stone. You are quick to judge motives. Something tells me that all your righteous indignation is an attempt to cover up your own sinful proclivities. Glass houses, Judith.

 

Then by your definition, no one before the Exodus should have died and none should have been cast into hell.

 

I do not understand your logic. Can you explain?

 

You sound like you have found your excuse for sinning. ALL sin is a choice. If truth hurts us then we need to be hurt.

 

YES! One sin makes us a sinner and all sinners need to be saved if they want to escape hell. It is not about the quantity of sin or the seriousness of the sin. It is about us being sinners that need to be saved.

 

Yes!

Of course.

ALL have sinned.

Believers are NOT condemned, even if they lie (not as a practice) but as one who stands needing to have "confession (of our sin) and cleansing from all unrighteousness." That confession is not the reapplication of blood, for Christ shed the blood once. Rather, the confession is the "Godly sorrow" of the believer who comes to understand and view the affront as God does; therefore, opening their heart, mind and body to such cleansing necessary that they learn from their actions.

However,

I think what you are trying to ask is the "practice" of lying that often accompanies one who is not a believer.

The Scriptures place the principle that the practice of a sin is perhaps an indication of the lack of true conversion, or one that has set aside that which they have been redeemed from and embrace it again.

For a believer to "practice" sinful living is to expect God to rebuke and even to remove them from this living so they do not continually stain His name.

For one to "practice" sinful living and not have the evidence of God's rebuke in their life shows a lack of being redeemed.

 

I would add one more thing to that last sentence. If one is being convicted about an action and does not forsake it then there is no reason to believe that they have been saved. Even the lost have convictions of their wayward ways.

 

Judith, perhaps it would be good to remember:
1) Christ shed His blood once for all sin. Sin does not send one to hell. The lack of belief does so very nicely. (See John 3)
2) No one who practices (without rebuke from God) a sinful living is redeemed (letters of John).
3) There is NO condemnation from past, present, or future concerning the believer. For all believers are "in Christ" and have the Holy Spirit of God within them. (Romans).
4) The quality of living and the seriousness of sinful ways are what is shown at the final judgement of God. (Revelations)

 

It is true that "by their fruits you shall know them..."

However, it is not our responsibility to investigate the heart of another person, but examine ourselves as to whether we are "in the faith" or not.

The unsaved may certainly have worldly repentance more often considered by statements such as: I'm sorry, my bad, I messed up, that was wrong, ...

But the believer (according to Paul) has Godly sorrow, which leads to forgiveness and life (that is not eternal life or hell, but life as that not which brings the cessation of physical viability).

The letters of John have much concerning these things that folks more often grab one phrase or a verse and think all is well.

However, John is rich in expressions of doctrine and believer treatment of both sin and unity.

 

Again you seem to be trying to justify lying. You are doing so with the claim of grace. The Psalmist wrote this;

Psalm 19:13 King James Version (KJV) 13 Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression. King James Version (KJV)

Leaning on grace to do sin is presumption. So again. It IS NOT OK for a believer officer or any other profession to lie under any circumstances. Let the lost pile up their sins against God and the believer walk in the Spirit.

 

You have a reading comprehension problem.