Featured 2 Thessalonians 2:13 What does it say?

….. because God hath chosen you from the beginning to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief in the truth”…. (as best as I can remember)….

I have seen this quote several times as a proof text…. To what end I am not sure. I think to show the “choosing” was based on our belief.

But….. is that what the verse says?

First… they are chosen from the beginning to salvation. That seems pretty self explanatory. Whatever else you believe about this “choosing” it is personal and it occurred from the beginning of human existence.

Second… the word “through”. Obviously the word “through” is giving the “how”. The question is, does “through” describe the choosing or does it describe the salvation? The context, in my opinion, is it describes the salvation… it is the “how” that salvation is accomplished.

Third… “sanctification of the Spirit”. This word is similar to “hagios” (Holy) and refers to being “set apart” for a specific (holy) purpose.

So far we have God choosing a people from the beginning and Holy Spirit setting them apart for salvation…

Forth… “and belief in the truth” Since “and” is used, it is connected to God Holy Spirit setting these people apart. The “truth” must refer to the gospel of Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

So, according to this verse, God chose a specific group of people for salvation from the beginning. Those He chose were sanctified (set apart) by God Holy Spirit and we’re brought in that right relationship with God through belief in the truth and that too is connected to God Holy Spirit’s work in sanctifying them.

Let’s try to stay focused on the meaning of the passage.

peace to you

 

Let’s focus on 2 Thessalonians 2:13, for now.

The word “through” is referring to “salvation”, not “choosing”, do you agree?

peace to you

 

I’m not really sure what distinction you are making. You are saying the “sanctification” of God Holy Spirit precedes both the choosing and the salvation. I don’t see how that supports the argument that the “choosing” occurs in response to faith.

Paul makes the statement “God hath chosen you from the beginning to salvation”. That is a stand alone statement of truth.

Paul adds.., “through…” which either refers to the “choosing” or to the “salvation”. The context supports “through” as referring to the “salvation” and elaborates on that aspect since it mentions the work of God Holy Spirit in “sanctification” which is “setting apart” for a purpose which also refers to salvation.

peace to you

 

The Jewish mindset would have recognized “from the beginning” to be referring to God creating the heavens and the earth since that word is used in Genesis. I believe that is what Paul had in mind and almost every commentary I read agrees.

However, I read one commentary that agreed with you that “from the beginning” referred to the beginning of the Christian gospel being preached. So we disagree.

I checked Bill Mounce commentary on the verse. He stated the same thing that I have been saying, that “through” is modifying “salvation” and not “choosing” and he gave the grammatical reason for it.

He even addressed the fact that the preposition used here is sometimes used as an adverb to modify a verb instead of a noun. There is no “fixing” as you stated, just proper understanding to Biblical Greek grammar in context.

If I knew how to link to his commentary, I would, but I’m not particularly knowledgeable in that area.

Thanks for the comment.

peace to you

 

I heartily agree. It is part of the “choosing”.

Thanks for the comments

peace to you

 

Please cite your source that Mr. Mounce is at odds with the “vast majority” of translators. I’m guessing you are referring to “through” as modifying “salvation” and not “choosing”.

Mr. Mounce explained the use of Biblical Greek grammar in this context. If any specific scholar disagrees, please point him/her out and I will read what they say.

And, Mr. Mounce didn’t “change” anything in the text. He explains that there are times in Biblical Greek when the preposition “en” (in, into, through…,) can function as an adjective (for nouns) or as an adverb (for verbs)

That is a well known fact among biblical scholars.

peace to you

 

The quote I gave to start the thread says “…to salvation..,” I haven’t seen any that say “to be saved” and Mr. Mounce doesn’t say “to be saved” either, and specifically agrees it is a noun. so I don’t know what you are claiming.

God chose them “from the beginning” to salvation. I coveted that more than once. I specifically stated I disagreed with your position of a “unspecified time” and that Paul was referring to the creation.

I read half a dozen commentaries on the verse and all but one agreed it referred to from creation. None agreed with your “unspecified time” though one believed it meant from the beginning of the gospel going forth. I didn’t see any that stated you are chosen because of your faith. That contradicts the sanctification of the Holy Spirit which occurs prior to belief in this verse

The question is what does “through” modify? Mr. Mounce gives specific details of why the “en” refers to “salvation” in this context and not “choosing” including the flow of the discourse and other uses by Paul.

I understand your position and I disagree. The “through” is modifying “salvation” and not “choosing”.

Thanks for the conversation. We have made our positions clear. I don’t see anything else to add.

peace to you

 

Any good scholar is going to give the various translations. He explained his position based on the Biblical Greek and makes a compelling case that “through” is referring to “salvation” and not “choosing”

Thanks for the conversation

peace to you

 

Well, I would hesitate to make the accusation of “false claims” toward a man widely accepted as an expert on Biblical Greek.

Why don’t you link to Mr. Mounce’s page so others can read everything he says about this passage and comment?

peace to you

 

And, as I have said, I disagree.

peace to you