Charles Stanley

Then your answer is unbiblical and therefore wrong.

John 14:6 -- I am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father except through me.
Rom 10:17 -- Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of Christ.

Those who do not hear the message of Christ and respond in faith and repentance will not go to heaven. There are no exceptions.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rhoneycutt:
*Excerpt from a Radio address of July 31, 2001 entitled "Reconciling Gods Love with his Justice"
In it Dr. Stanley is talking about how amazing gods grace is and about his unconditional love for mankind.
he asks the following
...would God send somebody to hell because they did not recieve Jesus whom they never heard about or never had the privelege of knowing about? My answer is no he would not.

Thoughts?

[ September 08, 2001: Message edited by: rhoneycutt ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

We know these things:

The Lord is good to those who seek Him
Lamentations 3:25 The LORD is good to those who wait for Him, To the soul who seeks Him.

No one seeks God of their own will
Romans 3:11 There is none who understands; There is none who seeks after God.

God is the seeking shepherd
Ezekiel 34:12 "As a shepherd seeks out his flock on the day he is among his scattered sheep, so will I seek out My sheep and deliver them from all the places where they were scattered on a cloudy and dark day.

All of the elect will come to Christ
John 6:37 "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

No one can come unless the Father draws him
Jn 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Conclusion: Not one of God's elect sheep will ever be in fear of not hearing, not believing, and not coming, for "it is not of him who wills, nor of him who runs, but of God who shows mercy." (Rom 9:16).

[ September 08, 2001: Message edited by: Chris Temple ]

 

rhoneycutt, my thoughts are these:

what did Dr. Stanley say
after that comment?? If he stopped preaching after that comment, I'd say he's got some wrong doctrine there. However, if after that comment he justified it with a comment like "Jesus doesn't send people to hell . . . we have a choice of accept or rejecting", or something along those lines, then I might not think twice about it.

 

I, too, would be interested too in the total context of Dr. Stanley's statement. On the surface, I would totally disagree with his statement.

If what he says were true, that would rob missions and evangelism of their impetus. Why tell someone who's never heard about Jesus and take the chance that they would reject him and go to hell? Leave them in ignorance. And, send your missions money to me!

 

I am an exclusivist. I believe no one is saved apart from personal faith in Christ. But I don't think it's fair to reply to the posted quote. I'd rather hear what Dr. Stanley said in context.
As for Dr. Stanley being a political pawn, I think that is hardly the case. The conservative resurgence in the SBC was brought about because grass roots Southern Baptists were tired of seeing the convention piledriven by moderates/liberals and decided to turn things around. Dr. Stanley happened to be one of these folks.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rhoneycutt:
Chris
I think I saw where you were at SouthEastern currently, and its pretty evident from some other threads that your an SBC supporter. Does this surprise you or have I always had the wrong impression of Dr. Stanley.
Russell<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Russell:

I too would want to hear the whole thing in context. It may very well be that he meant that no one goes to hell for not knowing about Christ, but rather people are lost due to their personal sin.

I am really not that familiar with Charles Stanley's ministry.

 

Charles Stanley salways says things one way, the way people say it,( the unsaved, liberal christians), then turne around and gives the biiblical view. Without knowing what all he did say, incontext, my first thought would be that is probably what has happened with this quote.
I don't really know.
I have hear dhim say more then once that a person can't get into heaven without Jesus. I guess he could have changed his view. But I'd want to know more before deciding that.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rhoneycutt:
Pastor Larry, I was surprised to hear that Dr Stanley was advocating this posistion. I take it you disagree with him? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

If that is his position, then yes, he is absolutely outside of Scripture. As for the SBC, I don't really follow it. I am not in it. It is certainly not being run by fundamentalists though it is being run by conservatives. The conservative swing in the last fifteen-twenty years was because I think the "rank and file" were tired of having their convention hijacked by unbelievers. A book worth reading on that issue is David Beale's book, House on the Sand.

I am not a fan of Stanley and don't follow what he teaches or says.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TomVols:
The conservative resurgence in the SBC was brought about because grass roots Southern Baptists were tired of seeing the convention piledriven by moderates/liberals and decided to turn things around. Dr. Stanley happened to be one of these folks.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or rather, the fundamentalists stole the leadership of the SBC (by a narrow majority) through politcal practices that manipulated the sentiments of "grass roots" Southern Baptists.

Joshua

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rhoneycutt:
*Excerpt from a Radio address of July 31, 2001 entitled "Reconciling Gods Love with his Justice"
...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Please see thread in this forum "is Jesus the ONLY way?" beginning August 3.
I had a response on August 9.

Dr. Stanley was probably pointing out quite specifically that our SIN is what separates us from God.

Karen

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CJoshuaV:


Or rather, the fundamentalists stole the leadership of the SBC (by a narrow majority) through politcal practices that manipulated the sentiments of "grass roots" Southern Baptists.

Joshua<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

How do you steal something with a majority vote in a democratic process? This sounds like the bitterness of someone who didn't get their way. Perhaps your own views are not as popular as you would like them to be ...

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rhoneycutt: Dr. Stanley asks the following ...would God send somebody to hell because they did not recieve Jesus whom they never heard about or never had the privelege of knowing about? My answer is no he would not.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

rhonrycutt, it does no justice to any preacher if you take a paragraph out of his sermon and then ask a question about his sermon based on that paragraph. It is like the man who wanted a revelation from God, opened his Bible and pointed to a verse which said ".... he went out and hanged himself." Then he said, I must try once more and opened his Bible to an other place and pointed his finger where it said, "... go thy way and do thou likewise." Now, is that the will of God? No offense, but your question sounds to me the same.

 

Joshua wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Or rather, the fundamentalists stole the leadership of the SBC (by a narrow majority) through politcal practices that manipulated the sentiments of "grass roots" Southern Baptists.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Joshua, my friend, this post is dripping with bitterness and. shows just how out of touch with the average SB the middle/left is and was. The moderates/liberals in the SBC had their iron curtain brought down by rank and file Southern Baptists and the moderates/liberals still haven't gotten over it and probably never will.

Now, back to the subject at hand....

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by rhoneycutt:
TomVols,
I don't think any one would say Dr. Stanley was a pawn. I said political animal. Big difference.
Interesting thought on why the shift in power from conservatives to fundamentalists. I can honestly say thats a new on on me<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I understand. My apologies if I misrepresented your feelings.
As for my thought on the power shift, it is widely held among both conservatives and the moderates/liberals I have known in the SBC/CBF. The overwhelming majority of CBF folks I know even acknowledge that the rank and file SB church never was very accepting of their rule or beliefs and got fed up with attempts to shove it down their throats. Even some CBF leaders have told me that.

 

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TomVols:
Joshua wrote:

Joshua, my friend, this post is dripping with bitterness and. shows just how out of touch with the average SB the middle/left is and was. The moderates/liberals in the SBC had their iron curtain brought down by rank and file Southern Baptists and the moderates/liberals still haven't gotten over it and probably never will.

Now, back to the subject at hand.... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


AMEN!

 

For those interested in hearing Dr. Stanley's message, here's the links. You need RealPlayer.
http://www.intouch.org/intouch/site.show_page?p_id=76101&p_id_from=77395&p_current_date=07%2F30%2F2001
http://www.intouch.org/intouch/site.show_page?p_id=76101&p_id_from=77395&p_current_date=07%2F31%2F2001