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John 12.32-33

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Frogman, Apr 27, 2003.

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  1. Frogman

    Frogman <img src="http://www.churches.net/churches/fubc/Fr

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    Really this context begins prior to verses 32 and 33; but you can read the entire chapter at your leisure and can judge the words which I shall write here according to the Balance of God's Word. I would begin the context with vs. 20 and would pay attention to vs. 26 to clear up any confusion concerning the difference between the gift of eternal life and service to God in this world. Look also at vss. 27-29 hear the spoken word of Christ at vs. 27 and 28, the response of God the Father, and note particularly the different responses of the men who heard the voice of God from heaven at vs. 29. Then Jesus begins to enter into the discourse which includes the vss. in question, note that he says in vs. 30 that this voice came not because of him, but for your sakes. That being said let us look at the scripture.

    vss. 32-33
    Here vs. 33 cannot, though some want to do so, be separated from vs 32, apart from vs 32 the 33rd verse has no practical meaning nor can its application be considered. So vs. 33 states that Christ is speaking concerning how he should die.

    Further, note that the word men is put in italics just as I have written it above. This signifies that the word has been added to 'strengthen' the meaning, but that it's addition is unnecessary. Note that without this word being added the scripture reads:

    "And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all unto me."

    note that we can accept the word "all" here as being inclusive of the whole of mankind.

    How can this be so?

    Here at John 12.32 Christ states that all shall be drawn unto Him, this is truth and cannot be denied. Men (the creature including women and children) shall be drawn to the work at Calvary, shall be enabled to find in the cleansing blood their deliverance and eternal salvation; or either they shall be drawn unto Him at the time of the Great White Throne Judgement of Christ, at which time they shall be judged and condemned. Either way, all have been drawn unto Him.

    God Bless.
    Bro. Dallas Eaton [​IMG]
     
    #1 Frogman, Apr 27, 2003
  2. Yelsew

    Yelsew Guest

    Is it the lifting up of Jesus or the cleansing by the blood what saves each individual person that is drawn to Jesus?
     
    #2 Yelsew, Apr 27, 2003
  3. BobRyan

    BobRyan Well-Known Member

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    In scripture we are told that the unqualified "ALL have sinned" - the unqualified all indicating ALL MANKIND" Rom 3.

    In the same way we find that the unqualified ALL - are DRAWN to Christ because God so Loved the WORLD (John 3) that He gave His Son as the "Savior of the WORLD" 1John 4:10.

    And so the DRAWING OF ALL mankind results in the enabling of ALL MANKIND to HEAR and to CHOOSE. To HEAR Christ knocking OUTSIDE the door and to CHOOSE to OPEN the Door of Rev 3.

    Stating the obvious again - but this seemed to be the place to do it.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
    #3 BobRyan, Apr 27, 2003
  4. Frogman

    Frogman <img src="http://www.churches.net/churches/fubc/Fr

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    I did not disqualify any.

    Because of context, I believe your reference here is speaking of the church which has fallen out of fellowship and is being misused to apply this to salvation.

    Bro. Dallas
     
    #4 Frogman, Apr 27, 2003
  5. Frogman

    Frogman <img src="http://www.churches.net/churches/fubc/Fr

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    Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin. Without the sprinkling of the blood on the ark of the covenant, this remains the seat of judgement, by the sprinkling of blood this becomes the mercy seat over which God will commune with his people.

    Bro. Dallas
     
    #5 Frogman, Apr 27, 2003
  6. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Question... Did not Jesus Christ die for all... That all might have a resurrection?... The blood applied to the elect who are raised in glory and eternal happiness and not applied to the non elect who are not and raised in shame and eternal torment. Else how are the dead raised if not raised in Christ no matter what their eternal condition?

    Okay now tie up this heretic and boil me in oil :D ... Brother Glen [​IMG] & [​IMG] Sister Charlotte [​IMG]
     
    #6 tyndale1946, Apr 27, 2003
  7. Frogman

    Frogman <img src="http://www.churches.net/churches/fubc/Fr

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    yes, I Cor. 15.22 teaches that very truth.

    As the situation now stands, you don't have to worry about being boiled in oil, think of the environmental damage, not to mention that we may run out of fossil fuels before the Lord meant for us to as current consumption is. ;)

    God Bless.
    Bro. Dallas
     
    #7 Frogman, Apr 27, 2003
  8. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    Preacher... I agree wholeheartedly... Let this Brother seal that statement with a resounding AMEN!... Brother Glen [​IMG] & [​IMG] Sister Charlotte [​IMG]
     
    #8 tyndale1946, Apr 27, 2003
  9. tyndale1946

    tyndale1946 Well-Known Member
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    I Corinthians 15:[20] But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.

    [21] For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.

    [22] For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

    [23] But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.

    So it does and there it is... I gave an exhortation on this last Sunday... The whole chapter!... Brother Glen [​IMG] & [​IMG] Sister Charlotte [​IMG]
     
    #9 tyndale1946, Apr 27, 2003
  10. Frogman

    Frogman <img src="http://www.churches.net/churches/fubc/Fr

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    Only man is content to make the Word of God contradict itself.

    God Bless.
    Bro. Dallas [​IMG]
     
    #10 Frogman, Apr 27, 2003
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