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Featured Images said to be Christ;Sacred or Sacrelege?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by T Alan, Dec 16, 2014.

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  1. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    I did and it doesn't matter.

    HankD
     
    #121 HankD, Dec 20, 2014
  2. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Replacing the Biblical revelation of God with ANY MENTAL image of God that PERVERTS the Biblical revelation of God in your mind is idolatry! This is what actually occurs when ANY ARTIST attempts to make a visible expression of any Person of the Godhead whether in stone, in wood or on canvas. That very expression stems from a PERVERTED IMAGINATION of what God is like and Who He is. That is what transpires when anyone is asked "who is that" and they respond that is "God the Father" or "God the Holy Spirit" or "God the Son" or "Jesus" not only because FACTUALLY IT IS NOT but more importantly because IT IS A PERVERSION of the Scriptural revelation of God that REPLACES that image in YOUR MIND which is manifested by your mouth - "That is Jesus" or "that is God the Father" or "that is the Holy Spirit" etc. IDOLATRY BEGINS IN THE MIND WITH A MENTAL IMAGE.
     
    #122 The Biblicist, Dec 20, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 20, 2014
  3. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    Hank D (*stern motherly voice) Play nicely or you will have to tell your Father when He comes home. ;)

    Everybody's thoughts matter (well except ) :)
     
    #123 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  4. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    ......that is your response?:laugh:

    1. Can you REPLACE God by calling something God that is not God?

    2. Does the Scripture reveal essential characteristics for a true mental image of God that defies visible expression as that would pervert that mental image?

    3. Would perversion or distortion IN YOUR MIND of that Biblical revelation REPLACE God in your mind with a perverted imagination of God?

    4. Does idolatry begin first WITH THE MIND and its mental perception of God?

    Just like adultery, can you commit idolatry first in the heart/mind?

    Just like murder, can you commit idolatry first in the heart and second by your mouth or words you express? (e.g. "that is Jesus")

    Just like adultery and murder is the law of idolatry "spiritual" (Rom. 7:12)? First violated in the mind even without actions?

    If you drew a picture of "God the Father" would not that reveal that you have REPLACED the true God the Father in your mind with a PERVERTED IMAGE that you have given expression to in paint?

    If you drew a picture of "Christ" contrary to all the revelation of Scripture concerning basic visible features provided by Scripture (ugly, nazarine not nazerite, semetic not German features and/or blue eyes) would not that reveal you have REPLACED the true Christ in your mind with a PErVERTED IMAGE that you have given expression to in paint?
     
    #124 The Biblicist, Dec 20, 2014
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  5. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    And all people of Jehovah sang:
    [​IMG]
     
    #125 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  6. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    :thumbsup: Replacing the Biblical revelation of God certainly would be idolatry. Forming a picture in your mind of the biblical narrative, however, is not. For many this revelation is more than words...more than something merely intellectual to consider. For many, understanding the biblical narrative involves picturing the events through which God is revealing himself to us. But I was unaware anyone was advocating replacing God's revelation. You are right here...that'd be idolatry - and it is an idolatry that many commit (not by picturing images in their mind, that is IMHO foolishness; they do this by picking and choosing what to believe and what to disregard as antiquated cultural concessions).
     
    #126 JonC, Dec 20, 2014
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  7. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    :applause: Congrats dude!!!! You overcame your difficulty in posting pictures. I bet if you try real hard you could post a rabbit. :smilewinkgrin:
     
    #127 JonC, Dec 20, 2014
  8. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    And what is the purpose of God revealing His true character in the Scripture if it is not to correct PERVERTED MENTAL IMAGES of God and provide the RIGHT MENTAL VIEW of God?????? Jon, your response is irrational. Replacing the BOOK (bible) is not idolatry as the Bible is not God.

    You cannot possibly deny that a visible image of God or Christ is not the evidence of that persons MENTAL image of God or Christ. If that MENTAL IMAGE of God or Christ PERVERTS what God says about Himself, then you are indeed embracing ANOTHER GOD in your mind that is different than the God revealed in the Scriptures.
     
    #128 The Biblicist, Dec 20, 2014
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  9. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    Yes, but I'm T Alan not "dude",I learned, no thanks to you. So just suffer through the images. Someone recently posted that "pictures" help people to learn. So get ready for class.:laugh:
     
    #129 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  10. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    The discussion is not about an image that has been produced by a mental image from the word of God, but from another humans image and purported to BE JESUS.
     
    #130 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  11. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I agree with you that replacing God with (fill in the blank) is idolatry. Where we disagree is that I do not think forming a mental images of Jesus (of His appearance as a man) constitutes a replacement of God or Christ.
     
    #131 JonC, Dec 20, 2014
  12. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    Is there an echo in here?

     
    #132 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  13. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    Nor do we! UNLESS, the mental image is NOT derived in the mind from the Scripture but from the brush of a man of ANOTHER human man model.:BangHead:
     
    #133 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  14. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    No, it's deja vu all over again :smilewinkgrin:

    (I guess we were typing at the same time).
     
    #134 JonC, Dec 20, 2014
  15. The Biblicist

    The Biblicist Well-Known Member
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    Do you even know what you are saying? It is not "picturing the events" that reveals the true character of God. It is not "a picture in your mind" of a narrative that reveals the true God. It is the explicit descriptions of God attributes provided within the scriptures that is intentionally provided in order to reveal, and understand the true nature of God.

    These intentional descriptions are designed to FORM A MENTAL UNDERSTANDING of who God is and who He is not. A WRONG MENTAL CONCEPT of God is the source of all visible expression of idolatry. A WRONG MENTAL CONCEPT is the violation of the command not to commit idolatry because the sin of idolatry does not begin with the visible expression or visible image but with the MENTAL IMAGE that is necessary to give that visible expression in that visible image.
     
    #135 The Biblicist, Dec 20, 2014
  16. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    This image, whether as a Black Man, Spaniard, Mexican or whateve's is not from a "mental image from Scripture".



    [​IMG]

    It's from the brush of a MAN using another "MAN" as the model and now is hanging in many places and at the least, suggested, that it is Christ.
     
    #136 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
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  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Whatever dude :laugh:
    But the issue is Scripture does not provide enough information to form a mental image...yet this is how human understanding typically works. Jesus taught in parables, and this allowed his listeners to picture (in their minds) the scene acted out. Yet if each painted what they pictured I'm sure they would be different. I understand your insistence that the expressions of one influences the understanding of another, and we disagree that this is idolatry.

    What is idolatry is when we alter Scripture to suit our own understanding. It is then that we see a god of our own making.

    Not that it "is Christ," that would be foolish nonsense. But that it represents Christ.
     
    #137 JonC, Dec 20, 2014
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  18. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    "Bruh"!.....................
     
    #138 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Yes...do you know what you are saying? You keep going back to these images (mental or visible media) are replacing God's revelation where I've never argued this to be true. Maybe if you'd slow down long enough to realize that I am saying these images are not replacing God's revelation (they are not revealing God) then you'd stop arguing that I am saying these images are revealing God. The represent what has been revealed on an individual level, but they reveal nothing.

    I understand what you are saying, Biblicist, and I disagree.
     
    #139 JonC, Dec 20, 2014
  20. T Alan

    T Alan New Member

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    Which is a false representation and Idolatry.:BangHead:
     
    #140 T Alan, Dec 20, 2014
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