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Is Your Baby Gay? What If You Could Know? What If You Could Do Something About It?

Discussion in '2008 Archive' started by Martin, Mar 3, 2007.

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  1. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    ==I don't think you understand what Mohler is talking about in his article. Did you read it carefully? Or did you just scan the title and the first few lines or so? You need to go back and read the whole article carefully so you can understand what he is saying and so you can comment on his actual arguments instead of commenting on more strawmen (like you did in this reply).

    Dr. Albert Mohler, President of The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, never said that "homosexuality is caused by a biological defect". He is talking about the possible causes of the temptation(s) that might lead someone to struggle with homosexual feelings. He is not saying the sin of homosexuality can be excused via biology. He directly said that it cannot be. Mohler directly stated that homosexuality is a sin because God's Word says so! Did you read that part? I doubt it.

    ==More evidence that you have no clue what Mohler is talking about.

    If you re-read his article you will see that he is refering to the results of the fall. Do you deny the fall and it's results in creation? Certainly you acknowledge that God did not create still born babies, babies born with AIDS, addicted to crack, with heart defects, or anything like that. All of that is the results of the fall. You will acknowledge that I trust.

    All Dr. Mohler is suggesting is that maybe there is a biological defect, caused by the fall, that is causing some people to be tempted with homosexuality. He is not saying that homosexuality can be excused or is not sinful. In fact he directly stated the opposite! This is not about the behavior this is about the temptation and one of it's possible sources.

    I would imagine you would not object to someone saying that a person's environment or sociology might tempt them with homosexuality. I also would imagine you would not object to someone saying that demons might tempt someone with homosexuality. Why is fallen biology any different? Or do you believe that biology was not affected by the fall?

    ==Nobody is questioning the sinfulness of homosexuality. Maybe you should re-read his article, or more to the point, maybe you should read it for the first time?
     
    #141 Martin, Mar 6, 2007
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  2. I Am Blessed 24

    I Am Blessed 24 Active Member

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    Martin: I understand what you are saying. My only fear is that the homosexuals will take this farther than Dr. Mohler intended and use it for their own gain.
     
  3. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    ==That is a very valid concern. I can't argue with that. However I believe that is why we must be clear that morality is not determined by biology. This is why we must make it very clear that we believe human biology is fallen and thus cannot be used as a guide to correct morality. The Bible is God's instruction book to us to teach us what is correct morality. However I do understand your concerns and I believe your concerns show that do understand how tricky this issue can be. There are no easy answers to this problem.
     
  4. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    Here's a thought. You go to your dr. for a physical and after all the bloodwork, your dr. tells you that you have the gay gene. You've never had a homosexual thought in your life and now you're being told that you are predisposed to homosexual behavior. How do you deal with that?
     
  5. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Depends on how throughal the physical was, I had to walk out on a doctor once when I was in my 30's because he was touching where he had no business touching. I went in for heart trouble and I know where the heart is located. True story. I was told later that he was gay, but I didn't need to be told then.
     
    #145 Brother Bob, Mar 6, 2007
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  6. GodsRealTruth

    GodsRealTruth New Member

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    Yes Martin I did read the whole article and yes he is insinuating that he believes that homosexuality could be the result of a biological defect.

    What I am saying is homosexuality is a persons choice it has absolutely nothing to do with biology. It is a sinful and immoral choice one makes. Their biological makeup does not cause them to fall more into that sin than normal, it is a choice one makes.

    That is all I was saying. However, yes I read the whole article and understand completely what he is trying to say. He is more or less riding the proverbial fence rather than standing on God's Word. And yes I do know he is with the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, and it does not impress me one bit. If the man is not standing on the Word I dont care who he is he needs to be told the truth.

    The truth is homosexuality is a choice one makes and biology has nothing to do with it.

    Just expressing my 2 cents my brother
     
    #146 GodsRealTruth, Mar 6, 2007
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  7. Amy.G

    Amy.G New Member

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    That's horrible. I hoped you decked him.

    My point was that testing people for a gay gene is opening up a whole lot of other issues, not just how to cure gay tendencies. There may be a lot of people that have the gene who never become homosexuals. Knowing you have it would be a hard thing to deal with if you're heterosexual. Why one anyone want to know it? I know I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but I still don't see how finding a gay gene or any other gene that leads to sinful behavior matters at all. It won't ever change the fact the homosexuality is a sin and has to be dealt with spiritually.
     
  8. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    ==Then you are misunderstanding what Dr Mohler is saying. Maybe it is a terminology issue. We are not talking about homosexuality as a behavior but rather as a temptation.

    ==The behavior is a choice, correct. I agree with that and Dr Mohler would agree with that. The temptation is not a choice. That is true for most all temptations. We don't choose our temptations.

    See, I think you are still missing the point.

    ==Nothing he said violates God's Word. In fact what he said is in perfect agreement with God's Word. I think you are still misunderstanding what is being said.
     
  9. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    ==If a doctor did that to me they would have walked out of that room with a black eye and a lawsuit.
     
  10. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    ==Just a general comment. I don't know that there is a "gay gene" in fact I would argue that there probably is no such thing (it is just too neat). The root of the temptation in some is probably chemical in nature and not in the genes. I also don't see any reason why any "test" should be done. If a person is not dealing with that temptation then there is no need to do any tests. Also simply because a person is tempted with homosexual feelings does not mean they are homosexual. They are only a homosexual if they act out (in thought or deed) on those feelings/temptations.

    ==As Mohler said it may help those who are struggling with unwanted feelings/temptations. If they could be helped by this knowledge (through some medical treatment) then I think the knowledge is a good thing.

    ==Nobody is arguing against that.
     
  11. Brother Bob

    Brother Bob New Member

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    Believe me, if it happens you at first think it must be an accident and just can't believe it is deliberate. He never go far but far enough that I realized that it was indeed on purpose. He never said a word though. If you had just had a massive heart attack and was still very weak, you wouldn't do much hitting, believe me.

    I wouldn't doubt if the Lord didn't takecare of it, he died in a plane crash just a few days later.
     
    #151 Brother Bob, Mar 6, 2007
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  12. Martin

    Martin Active Member

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    ==ouch.....
     
  13. amity

    amity New Member

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    There is difference between homosexuality and homosexual behavior. What we are saying is that homosexuality as an 'orientation,' or as Martin puts it the 'temptation,' is biologically overdetermined. The decision to act on the impulses is where 'choice' comes in. One can be a homosexual and never participate in a single homosexual act in one's life. One can also be hetersexual and never participate in a single heterosexual act in one's life.

    And of course not everyone who participates in homosexual activity is truly homosexual in orientation. Lots of people feel they want to "experiment" with different types of sexuality. But at bottom they wind up finding out they are truly heterosexual. That is too bad, and it is wrong, but that is the prevailing culture of the world we are living in today. When I was in college someone told me "How do you know if you haven't tried it?"
     
  14. Bible-boy

    Bible-boy Active Member

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    Due to the subject matter of this thread and the page length it is now being closed. The main reason is that if you are not logged in to a BB user account and browsing this thread it contains Google ads for such things as "Children’s Books for Lesbian Parents" etc. We don't need for the BB to serve as an advertising platform for such material.

    Yours in Christ,

    Bible-boy,
    Forum Moderator
     
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