Preachers

Don't have time today, Magnetic Poles, but I'll take a look at this stuff later. I remember some of the fuss about all of this, but to tell the truth the great majority of the secular media was in those days (and still is) so negative against us Fundamentalists that the climate among us in those days was to immediately side with Roloff.

Frankly, after the horror stories I know concerning how Fundamentalists have been mistreated and vilified and misunderstood and misquoted--etc. ad nauseum--by the secular press, I still have issues. Not that I know you, Magnetic Poles, or anything about you and your job and your attitude. But I immediately add a huge grain of salt to anything I hear in the media about Christians in general.

 

Not hardly so fast, there. Not 'zackly! Unless you are now suggesting reincarnation! 'Sides, EdEdwards regularly posts quotes from a 1611KJV, with sometimes, they's a-from Hebrews. And yo' grandaddy wasn't around then. (Although do I think I once heared (sic) that he mightta' fought alongside Ol' Robert E. Lee and 'Stonewall' Jackson in the War Between the States. Heh! Heh!)
As you know, I had the privilege of meeting John R. Rice, one time, in the spring of 1969. And to me, then barely beyond a teenager, it seems like he was already really, really old, then, like at least a 'hunnert' 'n ten or so, or maybe, hunnert and twenny. :laugh:

Anyhows, on as to who wrote the book of Hebrews. Seriously, I do not know who was the writer, any more than the next person. Although, unlike some, I do happen to know several it was not. It was not Paul, James, or any of 'the Twelve Apostles'. It was some 'second generation' person. Possibilities would seem to include Mark, Luke, Clement, and Apollos, among better known individuals who fit the bill. I get this from the text, itself, which reads

Obviously, the Twleve were there with the Lord, "from the get-go", as was Matthias, according to Acts. James and Jude, as the brothers of the Lord, while not believers, nor disciples at first, were around as well; Paul claimed to have received his instruction directly from the Lord; and Luke said that his "perfect understanding" was "from above". So unless it was some completely unknown individual, the three best are Clement, Mark, and Apollos. I suggest Apollos, for a couple more reasons. (And the fact that Martin Luther made this same "lucky guess" is not one of 'em.)
The author is well acquainted with the Hebrew Scriptures, as was Apollos, about which this is said

That's what I derive and conclude, anyway. :thumbsup:

Ed

 

Well, Ed, if you want to actually get serious about this :sleep:, then I'll have to admit that the evidence for John R. writing the book of Hebrews is mighty slim! Sigh. I guess that if we are serious I'll have to admit that no, he didn't write it. The reason I know this is that it wasn't on the official book shelf at the Sword of the Lord that had a copy of each of his books!

I've wavered between Paul (as you know, the style is said to be like his) or Apollos. You make a good case for Apollos. :thumbsup: And as long as the OP was about preachers of the past we'd like to hear, wouldn't it have been great to hear Apollos speak, considering what the Bible says about him! :saint:

 

Somebody might want to start a thread about the Roloff accusations, sorting out hearsay from good evidence. The accusations are easy to make and easy to believe, but those closest to the homes had a different report.

I knew some graduates. I knew one set of parents who placed their girl in one of the homes. I've been on the property interviewing the girls privately, away from any intercoms.

Law enforcement officials were always welcome; there was an open door policy toward them. The fight was over the rules & regs of the welfare departments, a truckload of philosophically driven idealism that cannot be reconciled with Scripture.

Start a thread. See what comes of it.

 

Well said, Pipedude. There is always a lot of hearsay in these matters--including what the secular media puts out--no offense to Magnetic Poles or his integrity.

 

No offense taken, brother John. The fact that two convictions for abuse occurred out of the events at the Roloff homes speaks for itself. Roloff himself never was convicted, but my research tells a different tale than what Pipedude has said.

I have always found that the adage, "where there's smoke, there's fire" holds true. And there was plenty of both at the Roloff homes.

Edited to add: My apologies for derailing the thread.

 

Amen as to hearing Apollos! Paul would put you to sleep! :laugh:

Ed

 

No, it doesn't. Theoretically, two incidents of "abuse" could occur at the best home for delinquents in the nation. Theoretically, two convictions could have been miscarriages of justice. Theoretically, the "abuse" might have been something we all did to our own kids as well.

It doesn't "speak for itself." It's just a rhetorical flourish until the hard facts are set forth.

 

I heard the best sermon I have ever heard at a youth conference at West Coast 2 years ago. Paul Chappell....

I would also love to hear MY Pastor's best friend, the late Dr. Curtis Hudson. and yes, Spurgeon would've been an incredible experience.


:jesus:

 

Well, I am late to this post, but I could not resist.

Favorite Preachers to listen to or sit under;

1. Jonathan Edwards. (Would have liked to have been there when he preached "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God." Whew!)

2. Charles Spurgeon.

3. George Whitfield.

4. John R. Rice.

5. Peter. (Especially during his delivery to the crowds right after the coming of
the Holy Spirit at Pentecost.)

6. Paul. (Even though apparently he did not speak well, a weak thin voice was it I think, I would be there everyday and every evening! Why I would be his scribe!)

7. Polycarp. (Eloquent and persuasive. Also a student of the Apostle John.)

 

I'm assming deceased ones....
Spurgeon
Boyce
Broadus
Gill
Dagg
Lloyd-Jones (not strictly Baptist)

 

Lester Roloff isnt guilty of anything. Since when is the media unbiased? Any accusations otherwise is shameful.:BangHead:

 

Jesus - He said it all.

John the Baptist - He could baptize with the best of them.

Jeremiah - whew! He prophesied Jesus the Christ.

Isaiah - He saw the Anointed One coming.

Ezekial - He told us to be watchmen!

Peter - That dude could spit out the Gospel so quick it could make a lame man get up and walk.

Paul - wellllll, he could make a king listen.

My Granddad . . . that man new how to preach with the best of them.

 

Ed,

Maybe he was just long winded . . .

Never knew a good preacher that wasn't . . .

Wayne

 

Has anyone mentioned Christmas Evans?
Oswald Chambers?

 

I am very blessed because my Pastor is a Old Fashioned kind of preacher. He is great!

You sit there many times just on the edge of your seat, not wanting to even breath. Except for the every so often, times, you let out a BIG AMEN! He is a powerful preacher.

But I sit under his preaching, so who would I of liked too? I think I would of liked to sit under some of Spurgeon. By the little bit of what I have read, he is a to the point preacher, with scripture to back it up. (take note, I would not of joined his church though).

Lester Roloff would of been a blessing to see in person too.

Here, I got one.... How about Stephen.

If more had the guts Stephen had, we would be in alot better shape today. AMEN?

:jesus: Name above all names! Blessings, Colleen

 

I dont see one bit how proper "projection" or "voice training" is important. Seems to me being filled with the Holy Ghost would give the grace needed to project Jesus and voice it with zeal.

Maybe you were being sarcastic. But if not, this is a problem out there today, relying on things other the his grace, to get his message and protray his light out there.
1Co 15:10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.

Eph 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.

 

If there was enough crediable evidence then Brother Roloff would of been put in jail.

you had the state coming after him, and all you media people with all this evidence and you think that they would not of put him in jail. If it was all true?

Then on the other side of it, is you have many crediable men of God, who knew roloff personally, and his homes I am sure would of been open for them to check things out in. I trust the men of God, before the media or the goverment.

 

If you had met preachers like I have who have burned out their voices and had to have surgery or worse, you would know what I mean. Learning to use properly the vocal instrument God gave the preacher is not unspiritual by any means--unless you think using proper grammar is unspiritual, or learning the many other things you can learn at Bible college is unspiritual. I'm not talking about zeal here, only common sense.

But I do agree that the power and anointing of the Holy Spirit is absolutely vital. Any man who preaches a message without the sure knowledge that he is filled with the Spirit at that moment will be a dry failure.:type:

 

Oh and by the way, welcome to the Baptist Board, meandmykjv. :wavey: